Yeah, we had a good meeting last night, we were up in the “action room” which is away up the stairs unfortunately, so that’s probably how you missed us. Might be worth exchanging numbers with some of the Edinburgh folk for future things so you can give someone a ring or a text to find us.

Really positive, productive meeting. Discussed EAFA’s plan to send an open letter to UAF calling for greater honesty and co-operation; some extensive discussion of the threat posed by the BNP at the general election; talked a bit about the SDL’s proposed Lockerbie (agreed to be guided by local folk-the Dumfries and Galloway trades unions council have called for a demo on the day); and we also talked about the idea of getting involved in community organising and local activism in order to provide concrete alternatives to the far right.

This was the first Edinburgh SSY meeting in a good while, and we agreed to get them going. We’re going to be meeting again on Mon 8th March, in the Forest again, and the topic is going to be practical community organising, following on from the discussion last night. Would be great to see you there!

http://ssy.org.uk/2010/01/islamogeddon-cancelled/

It’s humorous and I think strikes the right tone, mocking them as a ridiculous and marginal group completely unrepresentative of Muslims in the UK. What I’m trying to say is that I obviously we should condemn reactionary Islamism, but I think saying “Griffin and Choudary two sides of the same coin” is just not true, because Nick Griffin and chums pose a significant threat to our society, Islam4UK don’t. Just as I think Scientology is a very unpleasant con, but I’m not going to devote my political time to Anonymous.

The most important message that anti-racists have to put out there is that the SDL is deluded in thinking there is some kind of Jihadist threat to Britain, and 96% of Muslims according to polls cited in the article above oppose killing in the name of Islam. And on top of that, Muslims make up about 3% of the UK population! We should be exposing the focus of the media and government and Muslims for what it is-a divide and rule strategy being deployed by the ruling class. I think making one of our main thrusts attacking Islamism doesn’t help get that message across, although I do condemn it and would say so if asked. But it’s not just constructing Islam4UK et al as a major threat plays into the SDL’s agenda-it also plays into the agenda of the ruling class imo.

most support for the far-right is economics-based not islamism. but the silence of the decent left on islamism is a factor in their support today too.

(is what i was trying to say)

“mobilise mass numbers to outnumber the SDL and occupy the streets so they can’t”, that’s a good way of putting it: the right tone.

regarding Islam4UK, what you’re saying sounds dangerously close (to paraphrase) to “we want the EDL off the streets because we’re scared they’ll win support, but don’t think the Islamists will, so leave them to it”. maybe that is actually your position, but its not one that can credibly explain things to non-supporters – you’d not be comfortable telling them that, and on that basis it cannot be a good enough justification between ourselves. honesty and credibility are our greatest weapons in the long run. what we’re looking at otherwise is censorship for the EDL, but for Islam4UK we censor ourselves through a fear that people get the wrong message? its just not credible.

people are already seeing the double standards here, just a wee look around the different forums on the web and there’s decent neutrals, and those who don’t following these things in detail picking up on it. it makes us look hypocritical and it ignores the festering sore that continues to breed support for the far-right. we’re not kidding anyone by ignoring the Islamist far-right.

we don’t have to actively protest against Islam4UK (who will probably never come to Scotland). merely by lumping them in with the BNP or EDL (as i believe is justifiable on an ideological basis, certainly in the case of the former) helps us cover this massive shortfall in our current position.

i would also add that Islam4UK are actually imperialists themselves: “Islam will conquer Rome” (placard at their Danish cartoons demo), a cursory glance of their old website will show their plans for the UK when they have taken over – all for the benefit of the Sun mind, who lap up their wind-up shite. these scum feed off each other.

regarding Lockerbie, i think we’ve got to be realistic and recognise that a few individual socialists etc in the town saying they’d welcome our presence will never be conveyed to a wider audience, and frankly the support of a select number of individuals is no mandate for our attendence. really we’d (imo) be needing the vocal support of a victims/ relatives group for such a mandate which, i suspect, is not going to come. they want peace and we should respect that.

we have to give greater recognition to the wider narrative and the affect our actions and events have on that narrative. turning up in Lockerbie and running around the town shouting and screaming (as happens with such events) would not be beneficial, regardless of a few locals being amongst our number.

If you’re reading this and you’re in Lockerbie, get in touch!

First on the lying thing-no worries, easy to see how it was a misunderstanding.

Of course I agree that political Islam is a wholely reactionary, and dangerous ideology. It’s not even necessarily anti-imperialist. I definitely condemn suicide bombings etc. However, I just think it’s the wrong emphasis when Muslims are under attack as a group to give any ground to the idea that we face a significant threat from Islamism that is worth protesting about. The truth is we don’t really. Of course there are a tiny number of nutters willing to kill for Islamism, but it’s nothing compared to even the IRA bombings in the past. The reason there is so much attention on the issue in society is to allow the state to construct Muslims as an enemy and deflect attention from their own failings.

Simply put I don’t think we should give any credence to the idea that Islamism poses enough of a threat to the people of the UK to warrant a protest about it, because I don’t believe it does. If I was asked about it I would say first of all that I condemn terrorism, and am opposed to Sharia law. However, I would also add that the UK can virtually eliminate the terrorist overnight if we stop participating in imperialist oppression of Muslim (and non-Muslim) countries, and begin to change the alienating, racist society that drives people into the hands of a crazy ideology.

I actually agree that it’s important for us to state openly we’re not looking to give violence obsessed hooligans what they want. EAFA is meeting tonight, I’m in Glasgow so I don’t know what will come out of it. I did try and convey the idea of what we were trying to do in my piece here though: mobilise mass numbers to outnumber the SDL and occupy the streets so they can’t.

firstly let me apologise if it came across that i was calling you a liar (which reading that back i appear to). what i said was aimed at other comments i’ve come across on the web, although i accept thats not clear the way i’ve stated it. apologies.

i agree that the mass media have probably moved on from Saturday’s events, but a statement on the EAFA/SSY etc website for the public record would still be a worthwhile exercise imo, and i know that i would be quite glad to post it up on other places on the web that i frequent – a well crafted statement would kill stone dead some of the shite being said about the demonstration (by those outwith the lefty bubble who have a squewed perception of it). to date the word “confront” seems to get bandied about a lot, a word which lays the onus of aggression on ourselves. as i say i think a public position of defence is more helpful.

turning to Islam4UK, i have to say that although i agree a position on islamism has to be “pretty carefully thought out” (definitely) i believe the position above that you’ve outlined lacks credibility. i agree that their activity is disproportionately amplified by our idiotic media, but regardless, as the political wing of a movement which has caused more death on our streets than the EDL ever will, they cannot so simply be dismissed/ ignored. nor can the concerns and fears of much of the population: in truth its fairly rational to be scared of being blown apart on a bus or subway train, no matter how unlikely we may consider it. those in and around the predessessor to Islam4UK, Al-Muhajiroun, have been guilty of carrying out a number of suicide bombings. these are all well established facts.

by facing up to this we wouldn’t be giving ground to the EDL to address the hate of Islam4UK, we’d be taking it away from them. and our position would simply be consistent.

finally, i note that there’s talk of the EDL marching on Lockerbie as their next activity in Scotland. this is a trap. no doubt about it, they will be desperate to lure us into hitting the streets of Lockerbie and causing minor havoc and upset. EAFA/GAFA would do much better to oppose the EDL at Waverly and Central Stations than venturing anywhere near Lockerbie. the media will give them a hammering for going anywhere near the town; the state may ban them on the request of residents and victim’s families; we don’t need to rise to the bait and give them a PR victory (sitting in a pub out of view would leave us on the news and in the papers, not theirs). i am sure the people of Lockerbie will come out and ask for their peace and quiet not to be disturbed and we should respect that, and if the EDL chose not to, lets give them that PR disaster.

alibi